The Playlist: How are you doing? How are you enjoying this whirlwind press tour?
Pablo Larrain: Good. It’s beautiful when there’s attention, no? It’s nice.
Sure.
I love the movie. Not only the result, which is a relevant part, but I love making the movie. I had incredible memory of the process. When you make a movie, you know that you have an amount of days. Somehow it’s like a marathon that your energy has to go up to point. This time, I would keep shooting it for months. It was so much joy. It was an incredible time making the film.
I read in an interview that one of your inspirations for the movie was because your mom was a fan of Princess Diana. Does she know that you were inspired by her? And what did she think of the movie when she saw it?
The thing is that my mom had some trouble with certain movies that [I] made. She thinks they’re too dark or too weird or too political or too complicated. My brother, who’s a producer of this film, and I decided to make a movie that she might like. That was the first thing. Then in that exercise, “How do we do that?”
One day, I came up to my brother’s office, said: “Hey, why don’t we make a movie about Diana?” He is like, “Why?” I’m like, “Because our mom has been dressing like her and cutting her hair like her for 40 years. I bet there are millions around like her and it’s the most incredible story. Before I got into your office, one, I spent the weekend reading on Diana. Of course, I knew a lot, but it’s completely indescribable. There’s no way you could actually crack the mystery of Diana. That is a good thing for cinema.”
How long ago was this?
Three and a half years ago.
At that point, three and a half years ago, “The Crown” had already come out on Netflix?
Yeah.
Knowing it might eventually cover Diana’s story, was that a concern at all?
Well, yes and no. Yes, because you don’t want to annoy people with the subject that is all over [the place]. At the same time, I felt that we had something to say and I felt that we had an angle that requires cinema. What we’re doing in this movie and the way that we are doing it, in my opinion, can only be made with the truth of cinema.
That is a good thing and it’s a good place to be because it lets you breathe. No matter what’s around you, you can always find your voice because we weren’t making a movie about someone that a breakup movie. It’s someone that is just leaving her husband and is living in that institution. She’s not deciding to become a queen. She’s walking out a door that had never had a lock and she could have walked for many years before. She never did, up until that point. The big step was to decide how much of the movie was going to be inside of her POV. Once we said all the time and we met with Steve Knight and said, “You want to write this? This is what I would like to do.” Which is really compressing just a few days, be inside of her mind, and try to figure how that breakup story, how does she decides to leave that family happens. Then he came with this incredible script that has what you saw. But, small things.
Had you already worked out that POV before Steven started writing?
We met in London and we had breakfast. We agreed quickly, really quickly, that she should be in every scene and it should be a very compressed amount of days. Probably where she just decides to leave him. Not just because it’s a good melodrama, but basically because that is when the most famous woman in the world, that was in the most famous marriage in the world, decides to turn her back to that narrative, to that life, and be herself. It becomes a movie about identity. It’s about someone that decides to recover her name and she has to go through that. I think we can all be reflected with that, even though that’s what Diana has. It couldn’t be more unusual, right, that she was born to privilege, that family, and then linked to the Royals when very little. Then she’s chosen by the Prince to become the Princess and have this incredible life. Then, eventually, she realized that it’s not going to work, like a lot of people on this planet [would]. She struggled with it and she just walks out. I don’t know, it’s just very simple and painful.
Was there anything you found out about her that either made it into the movie or didn’t make it into the movie that surprised you?
Well, I’ll speak of the entire process, right, because what happened to me is that I felt that we were making a movie about this sort of world fashion icon that was a very strong woman that went through this, all kind of psychological crisis, eating disorders. In this, she was trapped in the will of history, tradition, the things that we know. Then after the research and after having the script that Steven wrote in my hand, I was nervous because I just didn’t really understand who she was. I made the movie, I can tell you today, I had no idea who Diana Spencer was. It’s impossible. Whatever you say, whatever people say, whatever they think, is the wrong perception of what they see of her. The amount of mystery that she carried, it’s so big that it can be incredibly interesting for cinema because we will never be able to crack it. What I did understand during the movie, is that we were making a movie about motherhood.
I didn’t see that before. It happened because not only because we were shooting with the kids, but also because we had them on set. Because of the lockdown, we were shooting in places that they couldn’t go home. Often, they would come to the set just to hang around instead of being, I don’t know, in a room. I would have the kids sometimes sitting on the video [playback] next to me or they were, I don’t know, playing PlayStation in a room next door, or playing football outside with a ball and I would just come out. Thanks to them, because they had their mothers there too, right? I kind of understood that we were making a movie about motherhood. I saw myself reflecting on those kids, as a son. I understood that eventually when I grew up, I thought that Diana was a beautiful, sexy woman, that would dress in an incredible way that was so particular and enigmatic and weird and strange and beautiful, and so on. Then I discovered that she really cared about those kids, and the living memory of her is actually in the presence of those two guys that I don’t really know much about them, but they’re probably my generation. I started to understand that the original call that we had for our mother when we said, “Look, let’s make a movie for her that she can relate to.” It was starting to really make sense because then I understood that I was making a movie about a mother. I saw my mother on her, and that was incredible.
There is a scene in the film where Queen Elizabeth basically lets on to Diana how little their personal feelings, including hers, matter in the world of the Royal Family. How important was it for you to have that moment in the film?
Very relevant, because it’s somehow a breach of empathy between the Queen and Diana. They seem to be struggling. There’s a lot of things that have been said about the relationship, but I felt that, and still too, that it was a good way to create the proper distance that they had and to portray that, but at the same time, agree that they’re part of the same machinery and that is to be trapped in the wills of history and that you’re there to repeat a role, no matter who you are. It’s so difficult to be there because of course, they have so many things that are incredible. The privileged life that they have it’s just, it’s privilege, pure and golden privilege, as much as humanity can deliver, but it brings a lot of conditions that make that life very, very difficult. It’s what she discusses with Charles. “There have to be two of you,” he says. “In order to understand that those two roles must be accomplished, you have to do things that your body hates.[Diana] opens her eyes and said, “That your body hates.” “Yes, I thought you knew,” he says. The movie doesn’t really focus on the relationship with the Royals. They’re there. What Steven, he focused the relationship with the other staff members because they’re their friends. Which is Maggie with Sally Hawkins and Sean Harris playing Darren. That’s where Diana really existed in that friendship, and that’s what’s fascinating I think.
Well, my last question for you is, many people were skeptical Kristen could pull this off, I was one of them…
You were one of them?
Oh, I was totally skeptical. I love Kristen and think she’s amazingly talented, but this seemed like a stretch. I was totally wrong. I will 100% admit it, but what performance did you see her in that told you that she could make this-
“Personal Shopper”
That showed you she could make this transformation?
No, it showed me that she can carry a very, an enormous amount of mystery. If you see that movie, you can’t crack her. You can’t really know what’s going on. It doesn’t matter how many things she says, what she’s feeling, what she’s going through. She has an internal angel that is just breathing in front of you in the lens, at least in the screen. As I told you before, even before I started the process of this movie and the very first research, I realized that it was impossible to really know who Diana was. Maybe having an actress that could play that mystery was a good idea.
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